[ -- peggy so rarely gets defensive. certainly not of other people. but rip is so beaten down, so disillusioned, so broken by his own circumstances. she can't help a bit of knee-jerk protectiveness. a quiet little glimpse of something not unlike how she tried to shield fitz himself during the actual interrogation. ]
[The eye-rolling persists until he looks to Peggy for agreement and finds none.]
....Because it doesn't. It's a limitation of third-dimensional perception.
[Is this something he'll have to explain to her? Who doesn't understand spacetime??? Ugh, where's Jemma when he doesn't want to have to explain things...]
[ certainly, he'll find no agreement -- but not for any bullheaded belief in time, its travel, or its curation. rather, peggy sighs. ]
That is a conversation you would need to have with him. I don't understand it -- but there are a lot of things, since arriving here, that I've learned I don't understand.
small>[ she folds her arms on the table. the point remains: what she does understand is how rip hunter thinks (or so she imagines) and she acted on that knowledge yesterday afternoon. ]
His is a strange world. With strange possibilities. [ she breathes in -- but at least recognizes there's nothing amiss in sharing what she's about to share. rip himself had shared it, after all. ] That event that had us all talking truths to one another. [ they promised not to talk about it, but peggy holds up a finger as if to buy his patience. ] The stuff that was happening in our rooms? The horrible moments looped forever? That was courtesy of his world.
[When she brings up the truth event, Fitz takes a breath to protest. His sound is muted only by the presence of her finger, but it leaves his eyes wide, cheeks puffing with unreleased air.
That event had been humiliating. They'd been in an abhorrent space, blurting out things that should never have been uttered. It shouldn't --
He deflates when she mentions the other half, the part that sent them all scrambling together in the first place. And for the second time in two days, he's reminded of his father's voice, the smell of sweat and stale liquor.]
[ she doesn't need much to remember the chill of the hydra base. or the sound of static on the airwaves. ]
Our worst moments on repeat no matter what we did to divert them. I imagine it's how he sees any given timeline: not to be changed or fixed or ameliorated, no matter how much pain it brings us.
[ nevermind that she knows he tried. but it's as he'd said as he apologized to the mansion's population shortly after the event had begun: time wants to happen. ]
So you're saying that he watches, as a historian might?
[It still seems like a useless task to Fitz. But perhaps in the future, enough people become aware of the fourth dimension to attempt to impact its integrity somehow -- as if that's even possible. At least he'll hold back the dismissive gesturing this time, for Peggy's sake.]
Something like that. It's odd to try and explain it. And not my explanation to give.
[ there's no need to court fitz's disbelief further, she supposes, by suggesting the lengths and breadths first the time masters and then the legends might have gone to in order to keep history on its proper track. peggy only knows what she can piece together from rip's careful allusions and ray palmer's much looser tongue.
nevermind that it's all very much in the past tense, now.
all she really wants is to impress upon fitz the reasons why he was called upon to answer that question. and, perhaps, why it was important that he lie to her while doing so. from day one of describing the shield agent to mister hunter, she'd been adamant that she wanted to see him as a resource and not a tool. the difference means so much to her, now, that she's unwilling to leave him in the dark. ]
But I do want to thank you for answering with a lie. [ she takes a beat while she considers asking fitz whether he knows the accurate coordinates, too. ] When I asked him whether I could share this much with you it was contingent on my telling him whether or not you'd answered honestly. As I said, these things matter a great deal to him.
You mean to say that you discuss these matters with him fairly frequently.
[Because Rip Hunter appears to know things. And he doesn't just know that Fitz is one of the SHIELD agents here. He knows seemingly everything that Peggy thinks about them as well.
He knows Fitz is the favorite, apparently. She hasn't disputed that part. Does that confirm that it's true??]
We meet regularly. [ oh, there's a hint of hesitation in her voice. ] It's why I was so certain he was gone. He would never miss one of our appointments.
[ maybe it's enough to stick firmly to the language of business. honestly, it seemed like such a simple pretext right up until she had to try and explain it to someone else -- suddenly, the excuses she tells herself don't sound so adequate any longer.
so she tries to phrase it some other way: ] He's the first person I met here in Wonderland.
[There's a small twist in his expression then, a stray thought that makes everything hurt just a bit.]
I've not stayed close with many of the first people who spoke to me here. There were a few disagreements regarding standards and practices. [They're the sorts of arguments he still finds himself facing when approaching the scientific community here. They're largely madmen or complacent cynics.]
[ hm. truth be told, peggy and rip disagree a great deal when it comes to standards and practices. fitz is himself a nexus for those arguments -- something she doesn't dare explain. but it's never strained them to the point of breaking ties.
if anything, the arguments keep her coming back. among other things. ]
I'm sorry to hear it. [ and that's sincere enough. ] Knowing someone from the very beginning -- [ someone i trust ] -- has been something of a comfort. A source of stability.
[ so much so that when she first realized how many people recognized her, how many people claimed to be from her world's future, she'd immediately sought him out again. ]
Shortly after I arrived, there was an event -- I don't recall much about it. But I contracted an illness from another world. A doctor took mercy on me while I was otherwise unable to help myself. She's no longer here, and I never got to thank her. But I like to think we might've been friends.
[ oh, look! it's their food -- delivered promptly and politely and peggy nods her way through a wordless thanks before sliding her plate closer. she goes for a chip first, biting it in half before managing to chew and swallow before saying anything. ]
Why is that?
[ a nosy question, surely. but she's curious. was there something naturally friendly about the doctor? was there some common ground? or is fitz merely expressing some sort of regret? ]
I think -- it was to be a terminal ailment. There were offers to kill the infected and prevent... Something. I'm not certain. But she she stayed with me, even though there was no reason to do so. At risk to herself, most likely. It was an act of impossible kindness.
[He fusses with the plate of food, touching one fry, then the next, while picking up neither.]
Possible. [ peggy corrects him, albeit far more gently than her usual corrections go. ] Possible kindness. Because it did indeed happen. And I can see it's left an impression on you.
[ those early formative moments! how different would their respective stays be, she wonders, without them. would peggy have ever bothered to know mister hunter better if he hadn't made himself a reliable source from the very outset? would she never have ended up in this situation, a day out of an awkward interrogation, if she'd showed up in someone else's closet? ]
[ she wants to stop him right there. she wants to assure him, somehow, that it's not a bad thing to bear witness to someone else's kindness and let it leave its mark on him. after all, the same thing happened to her the day he'd grabbed her into an awkward hug. that care and that compassion hasn't been forgotten. peggy's not sure she could forget it even if she wanted to.
but it's fitz, this time, to reins them back in. ]
I suppose it isn't. [ relevant. peggy proceeds to crack open her club sandwich and starts adding a few fries to the contents -- editing her meal on the fly. ] But nor is it strictly his hang-ups regarding how history should or shouldn't proceed that's got me asking you out to lunch today.
[ ah! the main thrust. peggy normally wouldn't put things in such plain terms, but she feels a bit of plainness is due this situation. ] Ordinarily, I try not to care too much what other people think of me. That's a conversation you and I have already had, Fitz. But I find myself wondering whether you feel you can still trust me after what happened.
[ she wanted to prove, she supposes, that she'd known exactly what she'd been doing when she'd courted rip's outburst. it's not enough for her to think she might keep his goodwill simply because she's peggy carter. no, peggy wants to earn that trust and keep that trust based on something more than a name. ]
[It seems like such a nonstarter that he's not sure why she'd think it's worth addressing in the first place. How could she not be trustworthy?? She's everything he'd ever hoped Peggy Carter could possibly be.]
What part of the issues from yesterday could possibly hurt that? It was a clean operation, all things considered. Reminded me of home.
[It's left him feeling useful again, as if he has something to contribute.]
Until just now, [ when he'd put the concern to rest, ] I could imagine how it might look. How a person might ask himself whether someone who treated a close ally like that, in an interrogation, might show him equal aggression one day.
[ the answer is (of course) that she would. she would hope to. but it's hard to imagine fitz compromised in the way she'd feared rip might be. ]
I wanted to explain that what I did was done out of a sense of -- loyalty, I suppose.
[ not that it matters. as fitz said -- it reminded him of home. and it's funny how that makes her smile just a little bit. it means more to her than she can say. ]
[There's something in what she says that pierces and sparks a return of his deflective grimace, a wince that presents itself as a ghost of a smile.]
If that was the concern, then please be assured that you were more gentle than I've been.
[He's already told her everything he cares to mention of Ward. He's sure that the connective tissue between the things she's seen and heard must be obvious by now. His lack of experience in interrogations was admittedly only an issue in an on-the-record basis.]
[ peggy nearly explains that compared to what had happened -- compared to what she did -- bruising the man up a bit might have been considered far gentler. but she holds that thought when fitz skims the surface of his own inconsistency.
no, she can't quite marry those two dots of intel -- but she can tell, at least, that there's something there to learn. ]
[Of course she understands what he means. He hadn't killed Ward and Ward was free to kidnap Jemma and himself and now he's going to help Hydra end everything.]
Sometimes we come closer to their methods than we ought.
[Should he have killed Ward when it was so easy? What would Coulson have said?]
[ a turn has been taken. perhaps it's for the best -- she can spool down that part of her mind that had stayed busy frantically defending itself from admitting feelings. with this, at least, she can slip back some semblance of what's official. ]
I take it you're not talking about the sort of thing happens merely in the line of duty.
[ because peggy does compartmentalize these things. many might disagree with her, but she doesn't count the enemy combatants she's killed in the field as people she's murdered. ]
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Not in his world, it isn't.
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[The eye-rolling persists until he looks to Peggy for agreement and finds none.]
....Because it doesn't. It's a limitation of third-dimensional perception.
[Is this something he'll have to explain to her? Who doesn't understand spacetime??? Ugh, where's Jemma when he doesn't want to have to explain things...]
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That is a conversation you would need to have with him. I don't understand it -- but there are a lot of things, since arriving here, that I've learned I don't understand.
small>[ she folds her arms on the table. the point remains: what she does understand is how rip hunter thinks (or so she imagines) and she acted on that knowledge yesterday afternoon. ]
His is a strange world. With strange possibilities. [ she breathes in -- but at least recognizes there's nothing amiss in sharing what she's about to share. rip himself had shared it, after all. ] That event that had us all talking truths to one another. [ they promised not to talk about it, but peggy holds up a finger as if to buy his patience. ] The stuff that was happening in our rooms? The horrible moments looped forever? That was courtesy of his world.
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That event had been humiliating. They'd been in an abhorrent space, blurting out things that should never have been uttered. It shouldn't --
He deflates when she mentions the other half, the part that sent them all scrambling together in the first place. And for the second time in two days, he's reminded of his father's voice, the smell of sweat and stale liquor.]
That. Was unpleasant.
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[ she doesn't need much to remember the chill of the hydra base. or the sound of static on the airwaves. ]
Our worst moments on repeat no matter what we did to divert them. I imagine it's how he sees any given timeline: not to be changed or fixed or ameliorated, no matter how much pain it brings us.
[ nevermind that she knows he tried. but it's as he'd said as he apologized to the mansion's population shortly after the event had begun: time wants to happen. ]
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[It still seems like a useless task to Fitz. But perhaps in the future, enough people become aware of the fourth dimension to attempt to impact its integrity somehow -- as if that's even possible. At least he'll hold back the dismissive gesturing this time, for Peggy's sake.]
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[ there's no need to court fitz's disbelief further, she supposes, by suggesting the lengths and breadths first the time masters and then the legends might have gone to in order to keep history on its proper track. peggy only knows what she can piece together from rip's careful allusions and ray palmer's much looser tongue.
nevermind that it's all very much in the past tense, now.
all she really wants is to impress upon fitz the reasons why he was called upon to answer that question. and, perhaps, why it was important that he lie to her while doing so. from day one of describing the shield agent to mister hunter, she'd been adamant that she wanted to see him as a resource and not a tool. the difference means so much to her, now, that she's unwilling to leave him in the dark. ]
But I do want to thank you for answering with a lie. [ she takes a beat while she considers asking fitz whether he knows the accurate coordinates, too. ] When I asked him whether I could share this much with you it was contingent on my telling him whether or not you'd answered honestly. As I said, these things matter a great deal to him.
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[Because Rip Hunter appears to know things. And he doesn't just know that Fitz is one of the SHIELD agents here. He knows seemingly everything that Peggy thinks about them as well.
He knows Fitz is the favorite, apparently. She hasn't disputed that part. Does that confirm that it's true??]
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[ maybe it's enough to stick firmly to the language of business. honestly, it seemed like such a simple pretext right up until she had to try and explain it to someone else -- suddenly, the excuses she tells herself don't sound so adequate any longer.
so she tries to phrase it some other way: ] He's the first person I met here in Wonderland.
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[There's a small twist in his expression then, a stray thought that makes everything hurt just a bit.]
I've not stayed close with many of the first people who spoke to me here. There were a few disagreements regarding standards and practices. [They're the sorts of arguments he still finds himself facing when approaching the scientific community here. They're largely madmen or complacent cynics.]
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if anything, the arguments keep her coming back. among other things. ]
I'm sorry to hear it. [ and that's sincere enough. ] Knowing someone from the very beginning -- [ someone i trust ] -- has been something of a comfort. A source of stability.
[ so much so that when she first realized how many people recognized her, how many people claimed to be from her world's future, she'd immediately sought him out again. ]
And we could all use more of that around here.
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Shortly after I arrived, there was an event -- I don't recall much about it. But I contracted an illness from another world. A doctor took mercy on me while I was otherwise unable to help myself. She's no longer here, and I never got to thank her. But I like to think we might've been friends.
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Why is that?
[ a nosy question, surely. but she's curious. was there something naturally friendly about the doctor? was there some common ground? or is fitz merely expressing some sort of regret? ]
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[He fusses with the plate of food, touching one fry, then the next, while picking up neither.]
I think she and Jemma would've gotten on.
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Possible. [ peggy corrects him, albeit far more gently than her usual corrections go. ] Possible kindness. Because it did indeed happen. And I can see it's left an impression on you.
[ those early formative moments! how different would their respective stays be, she wonders, without them. would peggy have ever bothered to know mister hunter better if he hadn't made himself a reliable source from the very outset? would she never have ended up in this situation, a day out of an awkward interrogation, if she'd showed up in someone else's closet? ]
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Most things do. Probably too many of them.
[It's a sign of weakness.]
But none of that seems particularly relevant to your friend's concerns regarding spacetime.
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but it's fitz, this time, to reins them back in. ]
I suppose it isn't. [ relevant. peggy proceeds to crack open her club sandwich and starts adding a few fries to the contents -- editing her meal on the fly. ] But nor is it strictly his hang-ups regarding how history should or shouldn't proceed that's got me asking you out to lunch today.
[ ah! the main thrust. peggy normally wouldn't put things in such plain terms, but she feels a bit of plainness is due this situation. ] Ordinarily, I try not to care too much what other people think of me. That's a conversation you and I have already had, Fitz. But I find myself wondering whether you feel you can still trust me after what happened.
[ she wanted to prove, she supposes, that she'd known exactly what she'd been doing when she'd courted rip's outburst. it's not enough for her to think she might keep his goodwill simply because she's peggy carter. no, peggy wants to earn that trust and keep that trust based on something more than a name. ]
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[It seems like such a nonstarter that he's not sure why she'd think it's worth addressing in the first place. How could she not be trustworthy?? She's everything he'd ever hoped Peggy Carter could possibly be.]
What part of the issues from yesterday could possibly hurt that? It was a clean operation, all things considered. Reminded me of home.
[It's left him feeling useful again, as if he has something to contribute.]
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[ the answer is (of course) that she would. she would hope to. but it's hard to imagine fitz compromised in the way she'd feared rip might be. ]
I wanted to explain that what I did was done out of a sense of -- loyalty, I suppose.
[ not that it matters. as fitz said -- it reminded him of home. and it's funny how that makes her smile just a little bit. it means more to her than she can say. ]
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If that was the concern, then please be assured that you were more gentle than I've been.
[He's already told her everything he cares to mention of Ward. He's sure that the connective tissue between the things she's seen and heard must be obvious by now. His lack of experience in interrogations was admittedly only an issue in an on-the-record basis.]
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no, she can't quite marry those two dots of intel -- but she can tell, at least, that there's something there to learn. ]
Is that so?
[ a nudge, at first. ]
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[Of course she understands what he means. He hadn't killed Ward and Ward was free to kidnap Jemma and himself and now he's going to help Hydra end everything.]
Sometimes we come closer to their methods than we ought.
[Should he have killed Ward when it was so easy? What would Coulson have said?]
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[ on that front she is adamant. ]
It's one thing to let the other side think you'll stoop to their level -- quite another to start stooping.
[ which isn't to say she hasn't taken the moral low road on more than one occasion. just that...there are places she won't go. shouldn't go. ]
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Jemma knows about it. She knows more than he does. He's the farthest one back, he thinks.
Should she know? Can she know? Is it even relevant?]
I nearly murdered Grant Ward.
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I take it you're not talking about the sort of thing happens merely in the line of duty.
[ because peggy does compartmentalize these things. many might disagree with her, but she doesn't count the enemy combatants she's killed in the field as people she's murdered. ]
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